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Recommend solution for feeling groggy/tired in morning

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randomCPAPguy +0 points · almost 3 years ago Original Poster

Hi,

I’ve never really posted, though I have read through some sleep apnea forums to try to find a solution to feeling extremely groggy from your CPAP or APAP machine. I have a ResMed Airsense 10 that I started using 6 months ago. I definitely have enjoyed the benefits, but I found that I was sleeping through alarms and taking hours to feel normal again. Prior to my ResMed machine, I could literally wake up at any time with an internal alarm clock in my head if I knew when I needed to be up. So, after realizing this new problem, I started putting triple Keurig doses (yes, cold black un-fresh coffee) next to my bed ready to go, multiple alarms, etc. I read on several forums about some mobile apps that help to get you out of your deep sleep gradually using progressively increasing sounds and white noise. I tried all of these, but none of these really worked (and in addition, the alarms woke up others in the house.) I would often fall asleep even after downing the coffee, turning on lights, etc.

I don’t know all the science behind it, but I know these machines get you into a really deep sleep state, and it is somewhat artificially regulated because it’s not the same sleep you’d get naturally. I believe I read that the sleep cycles are fixed for something like 30-45 minutes.

So here is the solution I found:

I went on Amazon and bought a Smart Wi-Fi electrical switch. There are many on there, and I’m not trying to peddle any brand. I believe the one I bought was called Sieges. The switch is a simple on/off circuit that you can control with your mobile device, and you can also set a schedule. So, if I want to wake up at 7:00 AM, I set the schedule on the smart switch to shut off (hence turn off the machine) at around 5:30....I’m sure I could experiment more to find the range of possibilities, but that may be for each individual. At 5:30, my ResMed shuts off, though I still sleep just fine and don’t wake up. During that time, though, my sleep seems to transition to a more natural state. Then a low volume alarm or smart phone vibration at 7:00 wakes me up and I am much more alert, ready to start the day like I was prior to using my machine.

Hope this helps.

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wiredgeorge +0 points · almost 3 years ago Sleep Enthusiast

Welcome Random... Glad you are getting deep sleep but I am not sure some of assertions are quite on the mark:

You wrote: "I don’t know all the science behind it, but I know these machines get you into a really deep sleep state, and it is somewhat artificially regulated because it’s not the same sleep you’d get naturally. I believe I read that the sleep cycles are fixed for something like 30-45 minutes."

A PAP machine of any sort doesn't have some diabolical sleep state control mechanism. You hit REM sleep because your sleep isn't interupted with OSA events. I think that when you go on the internet and read stuff, you should probably fact check the results. Sleep cycles are not fixed at anything.

Second point; turning off your CPAP and continuing to sleep is counterproductive as far as treating OSA. If you turn it off and sleep an hour and a half without the benefit of therapy, you are losing a large chunk of therapy; this is likely not a real healthy way to avoid being a morning zombi. I don't know why you feel groggy for an extended period of time but that might be someone someone else can take a stab at or requires a chat with your doc but coming out of sleep with white noise and increasingly louder noises? I doubt that is harmful but it just doesn't click for me. Talk to a real sleep specialist and not some internet self-appointed guru (like me bwhahahaha) and you are more likely to find some real answers.

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randomCPAPguy +0 points · almost 3 years ago Original Poster

Man, this is why I generally can’t stand message boards or online forums...I’m just trying to be helpful in offering a solution to a problem I’ve seen posted on multiple forums without a good solution. You are nitpicking about semantics. I never described a PAP machine as diabolical; the entire point is that for many people, like myself, your sleep patterns and ability to wake up with energy is altered when using a PAP machine. This is what is meant by “artificial” because you are using an external process to regulate pressure, and that is contrasted from your body’s natural sleep habits. In terms of losing 1.5 hours, or as I alluded to, could be less depending on some tinkering and your own individual trade-off and preference, I think it’s unnecessary to point out the obvious, which is that the machine will not work during that time.

There always needs to be some kind of defensive knee-jerk reaction to everything. It disappoints me that this is the very first response to my post. I don’t think you added anything to this discussion but did plenty to draw attention to yourself and advanced knowledge, however irrelevant it is in this particular topic.

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sleeptech +0 points · almost 3 years ago Sleep Enthusiast

That is an interesting solution to your problem. To clarify a few things: all CPAP does is prevent your airway from being blocked. The regulation of your sleep is entirely natural. If you have OSA then your sleep is not natural when you are not using your CPAP machine because it is being constantly disrupted by stoppages in your breathing (sorry about the double negative).

Sleep cycles are not 30 - 45 minutes. They generally average about 90 minutes but can be a bit longer at the start of the night.

If you have OSA for a long time and then start using CPAP, your brain can take a while to get back to normal sleep cycles again. It has had so many years of disrupted sleep that, when the disruption is removed, it gets all excited about being able to sleep properly and you have way more of the deeper stages of sleep that you have been missing out on than would normally be the case. It's called rebounding. It can leave you feeling very groggy in the morning. If this is what is causing you trouble then it should pass in time (sorry, can't be more specific).

I have friends who have fitness trackers with a vibrating alarm. They think it's great - wakes them reliably without disturbing anyone else. Have you tried anything like that?

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